The Sinden Lightgun

[sky2310]

Hey guys, like many of you I love arcade light gun games and they hold a special place in my heart growing up and going to the arcades and playing games like Time Crisis, Virtua Cop and The House of the Dead just to name a few. It's probably my favourite game genre right next to fighting and platform games but unfortunately it's rather old technology and no longer works with modern LCD TVs. There has been many infrared sensor bar-reincarnations including the EMS Top Gun, AimTrak Lightgun and the invention of the Wiimote motion plus which can be paired with the Mayflash Dolphin Bar and various software to work but nothing truly like the aim and shoot true lightguns of the late 90s. 

 

Now there is news that there is a new invention called the Sinden Lightgun designed by Andy Sinden who claims he is bringing back the technology to modern day TVs, but is it truly a lightgun to rival the designs by Namco and Mad Katz? I'd like to share my unbiais views in hopes it will provide more clarity for those who are wishing this project will bring back old memories.

 

More info on the Sinden lightgun here: 

 

 

The Pros:

- it allows classic lightgun games via emulation (doesn't fully support consoles at this stage) to be played on modern TVs

- The asking price of approx $120 USD seems to be fair if the tech truly works

- It looks and feels like a classic lightgun (wired) 

- Emulates a mouse and keyboard so in theory should work with most emulators and fairly easy to set up

- Does it beat the notion of playing classic games on a CRT/original hardware as better option?

 

The Cons:

- It requires a coloured border to be placed around the entirety of a TV's border which is quite thick and requires software to run

- Compatibility is via emulation only at this stage with various separate hardware modifications required on consoles to work (not plug 'n play and requires hacking console hardware)

- Is about the same price as an authentic Guncon, Mad Katz or other modern sensor guns so not affordable to must despite only working with emulators

- Is not wireless so isn't improving on old technology but then again so are the older guns

- The current build quality doesn't look very "high quality" but then again maybe it doesn't have to be

 

Although the motion sensor guns like the Wiimote Motion Plus set up isn't the best, I have to say I don't mind it as it gives me wireless functionality, is relatively cheap to acquire (less than $60 USD for the whole set up) and is also wireless plus it doesn't have that annoying white border and requires separate software and hardware modifications to work. I am "on the fence" with this new invention as I am undecided on whether it will truly bring back what the older guns provided and begs the question would simply obtaining an older CRT and playing the classic lightgun games on original hardware and peripherals be the better and cheaper route?   

 

Again, this is just a thread for discussion and an update on the status of new/old technology so let's see what others think. 

 

[grandvent]

For me, the biggest problem with wiimote is the latency: only dolphin has a passthrough which allows good reactivity. So I hope this one is better. There are some videos claiming a good latency... We'll see, but that really the point for me.

Aout the border: it's a bit annoying, but I use bezels on retroarch on the old games, so it's not too much of a problem to modify them to have a white rectangle.

[posted]

it's better our project works both in crt and in lcd..and they are wireless, with recoil option. search our videos on youtube ..

 

 

 

[beyyy18]

the border do annoys me a lot, personally.

Modifié le 6 novembre 2023 par beyyy18

[sky2310]

On 6/8/2019 at 4:29 PM, grandvent said:

For me, the biggest problem with wiimote is the latency: only dolphin has a passthrough which allows good reactivity. So I hope this one is better. There are some videos claiming a good latency... We'll see, but that really the point for me.

Aout the border: it's a bit annoying, but I use bezels on retroarch on the old games, so it's not too much of a problem to modify them to have a white rectangle.

 

I experience not lag whatsoever with the Wiimote as an external gun with the Mayflash Dolphin Bar.

I don't like the idea where there's a lot of non-standard tweaking involved with software and hardware to get this new gun to work plus the white border is such a killer in my opinion and also it has to be in a fairly well lit room or the lens won't detect the white border and will not work which is another negative part about it. But it's still early days so let's give it a chance.

 

[sky2310]

On 6/12/2019 at 4:14 AM, beyyy18 said:

the border do annoys me a lot, personally

 

Totally agree...plus it's not wireless and requires a lot of software and hardware tweaks to work and there's no guarantees it will work with all games and hardware either.

[crzmx]

I've looked into the Sinden gun quite a bit.  I'm not a huge fan of the white(colored) border, but I've thought of some solutions around it.  I'm not sure where you seen that the room needs to be fairly lit for the camera in the gun to work; there are multiple videos where the lighting is at various levels.  If you would've read the kickstarter information on the project you would see that the build quality that you are discussing is in the prototype stages, he needed funding to be able to get better build quality(those were 3D printed shells), injection molding.  He was also trying to make finished projects for consoles that it would be plug and play, the small hardware box would create the border overlay for you.  I think overall its a great project and can't wait to get mine, but I do think he needs to get a little better at consolidating his information and making it easier to navigate so incorrect information isn't being spread.

[sky2310]

23 hours ago, crzmx said:

I've looked into the Sinden gun quite a bit.  I'm not a huge fan of the white(colored) border, but I've thought of some solutions around it.  I'm not sure where you seen that the room needs to be fairly lit for the camera in the gun to work; there are multiple videos where the lighting is at various levels.  If you would've read the kickstarter information on the project you would see that the build quality that you are discussing is in the prototype stages, he needed funding to be able to get better build quality(those were 3D printed shells), injection molding.  He was also trying to make finished projects for consoles that it would be plug and play, the small hardware box would create the border overlay for you.  I think overall its a great project and can't wait to get mine, but I do think he needs to get a little better at consolidating his information and making it easier to navigate so incorrect information isn't being spread.

 

Hey bud, what I said are of course unconfirmed and speculated information without a full release but forums, videos and online sources note this. I think we need to also accept that this is a project-made-to-order item so we shouldn't compare it to the likes of the Namco and Mad Katz accessories as it will never measure up to it. I just think there's more negatives than positives at the moment but of course this can all change once the gun is officially released. 

 

[llll55]

My most anticipated product in the last year. cant wait for the october reviews:)

[sky2310]

10 hours ago, llll55 said:

My most anticipated product in the last year. cant wait for the october reviews:)

 

You know what's funny though...Nintendo has created a great "Lightgun" in the Joy-Cons where they can actually pin-point where to aim at the screen without a sensor bar on some games now so imagine games running on this technology. 

 

In my honest opinion, the Sinden Gun is going to flop as it's too hardware/software dependent but we're see. 

 

[llll55]

Le 1.8.2019 à 8:40 AM, sky2310 a dit :

 

You know what's funny though...Nintendo has created a great "Lightgun" in the Joy-Cons where they can actually pin-point where to aim at the screen without a sensor bar on some games now so imagine games running on this technology. 

 

In my honest opinion, the Sinden Gun is going to flop as it's too hardware/software dependent but we're see. 

 

Yes, someone should copy this tech and put it inside a shell gun....

[Invité linglang]

[sky2310]

6 hours ago, llll55 said:

Yes, someone should copy this tech and put it inside a shell gun....

 

Actually my point! This new technology is amazing and is the spiritual successor to the Lightgun. 

[sky2310]

Forget about the Linden Light Gun which is just terrible. The good news is we now have a lot of options.

 

 

[crzmx]

If you are going to bash a product, you should probably at least spell the name correctly.  I'm not exactly sure what issue you have with the Sinden gun except having the border, he's trying something different that should work with most emulators instead of repackaging an older technology with prepackaged games/kits(Pdp is cool, but nothing new).

[llll55]

I Just wish: 1. it had a movable recoil kick, like in namco arcade guns, and not an inside recoil.

                    2. it had the same trigger as the namco arcade gun, i love it, it soft to press and easy to play with for hours.

 

but otherwise, it looks great, and he said he will improve the gun with each new version of it, so in the coming years it will be wirless, and maybe a moving recoil.

and also he will sold the the parts without the gun, so we can build the gun as we like.

[Gwyllion]

En 13/9/2019 a las 18:03, sky2310 dijo:

Forget about the Linden Light Gun which is just terrible. The good news is we now have a lot of options.

 

 

 

Which is the best option for windows in you opinion?

[sky2310]

On 9/18/2019 at 10:50 PM, crzmx said:

If you are going to bash a product, you should probably at least spell the name correctly.  I'm not exactly sure what issue you have with the Sinden gun except having the border, he's trying something different that should work with most emulators instead of repackaging an older technology with prepackaged games/kits(Pdp is cool, but nothing new).

 

I don't have an issue with the project or the creator and take my hat off for his contribution, but, the concept is just not worth supporting. I don't know about you, but I don't want to play gun games with that huge white border on the screen or have to install plugins and hardware modifications. 

[sky2310]

11 hours ago, Gwyllion said:

 

Which is the best option for windows in you opinion?

 

I like the new PDP Mars model. Wireless, no modifications needed including that hideous huge white border and games will be made specifically for...but there's a laser pointer.

 

However, when we look at the whole situation, nothing beats the old Lightgun technology...everything just works and there's no need for any modifications or laser pointers.

[Gwyllion]

hace 4 horas, sky2310 dijo:

 

I like the new PDP Mars model. Wireless, no modifications needed including that hideous huge white border and games will be made specifically for...but there's a laser pointer.

 

However, when we look at the whole situation, nothing beats the old Lightgun technology...everything just works and there's no need for any modifications or laser pointers.

 

Has the PDP Windows driver? its only for Xbox one/PS4.

 

...anyway...wiimote and dolphinbar are the best for win, right?

 

is working psmove?

 

found this info: could be very important:

 

https://github.com/psmoveservice/PSMoveService/wiki

 

Modifié le 4 octobre 2019 par Gwyllion

[sky2310]

1 hour ago, Gwyllion said:

 

Has the PDP Windows driver? its only for Xbox one/PS4.

 

...anyway...wiimote and dolphinbar are the best for win, right?

 

is working psmove?

 

found this info: could be very important:

 

https://github.com/psmoveservice/PSMoveService/wiki

 

 

Totally agree...at the moment, Wiimote and Dolphinbar does the job very well.

 

By the way, what's the PSMOVEService do? Using the PS Move on Windows? How to do this? I'm intrigued. 

[Gwyllion]

Justo ahora, sky2310 dijo:

By the way, what's the PSMOVEService do? Using the PS Move on Windows? How to do this? I'm intrigued. 

 

It seems Works with PSEye instead of bar....too many steps to work...but if you have one, you can try. Could be a great aternative and not very expensive,...

 

Other option is AIMTRAK...90 bucks.

[sky2310]

3 minutes ago, Gwyllion said:

 

It seems Works with PSEye instead of bar....too many steps to work...but if you have one, you can try. Could be a great aternative and not very expensive,...

 

Other option is AIMTRAK...90 bucks.

 

I have original PS3 hardware with all the setup so might give this a miss, but I use Wiimote and DB's on most arcade games.

[Gwyllion]

hace 44 minutos, sky2310 dijo:

 

I have original PS3 hardware with all the setup so might give this a miss, but I use Wiimote and DB's on most arcade games.

Will try as well.

[Disco74]

Lightgun games are all about accuracy and although the wiimotes and aimtrak do an admiral job(I have both) I believe the sinden lightguns will be much more accurate.

The border is a bit of an issue but this can be made smaller and the colour change to be less intrusive.

I have backed the project and look forward to checking it out soon. Until it is released we really do not know how good it is.

[rockohoward]

1 hour ago, Disco74 said:

Lightgun games are all about accuracy and although the wiimotes and aimtrak do an admiral job(I have both) I believe the sinden lightguns will be much more accurate.

The border is a bit of an issue but this can be made smaller and the colour change to be less intrusive.

I have backed the project and look forward to checking it out soon. Until it is released we really do not know how good it is.

Same here. It's not as bad as everyone makes it and im sure it will still work without a border as a video shows him moving around windows without the border using the gun

[sky2310]

6 hours ago, rockohoward said:

Same here. It's not as bad as everyone makes it and im sure it will still work without a border as a video shows him moving around windows without the border using the gun

There always has to be a border and various hardware, software hacks to make it work. The problem with this project is it seems like an "underground" project as opposed to a new commercial solution which is one of the reasons, I think, it won't ever be effective. Don't get me wrong, I love lightgun games, but I don't think this will ever be able to live up to what the classic Guncon-type ones provided.

[Gwyllion]

In summary…" Better the devil you know" right?

...if finally Sinden goes to reality, it would be very nice...I have some doubts, as said by @sky2310 . 2 Kickstarter bet and both I lost my bucks….no more!

[ginzu]

Any news of this project since the last public update on the kickstarter on  septembre 2019 ?   

[Gtguy]

They are starting to ship out now.  Anyone who has one, please post their review.  

[Scripper]

Have mine for nearly two month now. Buildquality seems to be very solid. They work like a charm with teknoparrot and / or demulshooter.. The solenoid-option is also a "nice to have"..